Discussion:
Guardian Angels
(too old to reply)
Matrix Reloaded
2003-07-10 12:17:44 UTC
Permalink
Darell,
Of course guardian angels exist and yes they often influence the outcomes,
events and circumstances in one's life. That's exactly their job. Which they
do gladly and without need of thanks. But it's nice to appreciate and
acknowledge their presence anyway.
Saint Albans
Do Guardian Angels exist? Is it possible that they can see and help
influence the outcome of events in ones life?
Darell
www.knurgnal.com
It is not like people think;) http://puck.dhs.org /matrix more like the

Oracle says! Claudio
angelicusrex
2003-07-10 18:11:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Matrix Reloaded
It is not like people think;) http://puck.dhs.org /matrix more like the
Oracle says! Claudio

I'd much rather think that WE invented the movie "The Matrix" than thinking
that invention is actually describing how are lives are. The next movie like
Matrix which comes out, someone will be convinced our lives are like that
too.

We are NOT computer bits. We are vastly complex sub-atomic structures
reacting to the proximity and energy of one another. Computer codes are
simply ones and zeros on a SCREEN. It's not real life. I mean, I like the
movies too. But we are not being used as energy sources by evil machines and
forced to think we're having a "good time." Ask the people around the world
starving if they are in "The Matrix."

The trouble with computer people is they never get out and see babies
starving, or feel how it feels to live in a refrigerator box, or walk twenty
miles to see a doctor. We don't see war, except on TV and in movies. And
because we sit in front of computers, we see the world as computerized. It
is not. The Grand Canyon is not a digital image. Don't believe me? Go take a
trip there.

Instead of you telling me how you "think" the world works. Why don't you
allow your ANGELS to tell you exactly how it works?

Saint Albans
Tom
2003-07-11 04:16:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by angelicusrex
Instead of you telling me how you "think" the world works. Why don't you
allow your ANGELS to tell you exactly how it works?
Or why don't you just ask your dog?
angelicusrex
2003-07-11 17:03:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tom
Post by angelicusrex
Instead of you telling me how you "think" the world works. Why don't you
allow your ANGELS to tell you exactly how it works?
Or why don't you just ask your dog?
Because I don't have a dog. In your case you can ask your butt. It seems to
be where your brain is stored.

Saint
Tom
2003-07-12 06:20:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
Post by angelicusrex
Instead of you telling me how you "think" the world works. Why don't you
allow your ANGELS to tell you exactly how it works?
Or why don't you just ask your dog?
Because I don't have a dog. In your case you can ask your butt. It seems to
be where your brain is stored.
Saint
Now, Dave, there's no need for such negative energy. I don't see what's so
offensive about my question.

Maybe you should get a dog. They are good at generating positive energy.
Baruch
2003-07-11 18:40:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tom
Or why don't you just ask your dog?
Probably because no one is claiming that dogs speak to us, while some
*are*
claiming that angels do. So it would be appropriate to speak to angels
to
see whether they answer. You never know, until you try...
Why do you think no one is claiming that dogs talk to us?
A lot you know.
Sonya Fitzpatrick, star of TV's "Pet Psychic" has Seven Secrets to Tuning
in to Your Pet.
OK, but Sonya Fitzpatrick isn't posting on this NG...
Laura Simpson, author of "Communicating with Animals", says that some
... and neither is Laura Simpson.
So, if you have a question on world affairs that affects your hamster
directly, Laura says you can reasonably expect a sensible answer.
My hamster doesn't know diddly... he's got the brains of a ... well, a
hamster.
Now that I've completely refuted your claim that "no one is claiming that
dogs speak to us", tell me why one should not just ask one's dog instead
of
an angel. At least I can demonstrate to most folks' satisfaction that my
dog actually exists.
I amend my statement accordingly to say that no one on *this* NG is claiming
that dogs speak to us. I expect that there are some dog-oriented NG's that
do have folks making this claim, but so far it hasn't appeared here.

You may be able to demonstrate the existence of your dog to people nearby,
but you really can't demonstrate your dog to me. About all you could do is
to show that a dog exists - or more accurately, that the *image* of a dog
exists, since the best you could do is a photograph. You still couldn't
prove that it was *your* dog.

The thing is that you can test the idea of whether angels exist. You
*cannot* prove it to anyone else. You can't say, "here's my angel", nor
"here's a photo of my angel", nor even "here's a photo of some angel
somewhere". They don't come when they're called (not for others), nor will
they do tricks for you. They will, however, speak to you if you ask.

But I suspect you'll do as I did. Since I already *knew* that there weren't
angels, or that at least they wouldn't talk to me, I never bothered to
perform the experiment.

Imagine my surprise when I did bother, motivated by a desire to poke fun at
those who claimed to be talking to angels... I was trying to mimic the
person's style, and as I wrote I began to write stuff I hadn't intended. So
give it a try. The worst that could happen is, you'll spend a little time
talking to yourself... and you just might wind up talking to, and hearing
from, an angel or two.
Tom
2003-07-12 06:18:10 UTC
Permalink
Post by Baruch
Post by Tom
Or why don't you just ask your dog?
Probably because no one is claiming that dogs speak to us, while some
*are*
claiming that angels do. So it would be appropriate to speak to angels
to
see whether they answer. You never know, until you try...
Why do you think no one is claiming that dogs talk to us?
A lot you know.
Sonya Fitzpatrick, star of TV's "Pet Psychic" has Seven Secrets to Tuning
in to Your Pet.
OK, but Sonya Fitzpatrick isn't posting on this NG...
But *I* am posting some of Sonya's claims on this newsgroup. So now you
are aware that some people who post to this newsgroup are willing to
discuss Sonya Fitzgerald's ideas. If you don't want to talk about it, I'm
OK with that.

Still, I'm asking the question to anyone who cares to discuss it. Why you
shouldn't just talk to your dog instead of an angel.
Post by Baruch
So, if you have a question on world affairs that affects your hamster
directly, Laura says you can reasonably expect a sensible answer.
My hamster doesn't know diddly... he's got the brains of a ... well, a
hamster.
Heh. And no wonder. Nobody talks to him. How's he supposed to learn
anything about the world from inside that little cage? At least give him
cable TV.
Post by Baruch
I amend my statement accordingly to say that no one on *this* NG is claiming
that dogs speak to us.
Other than me, of course. I'm a lone voice, crying in the wilderness,
apparently. I think Dave St. Albans is willing to give talking dogs the
benefit of the doubt, although he still (understandably) recommends that
angels be included in one's conversations with dogs anyway. You, though,
seem to be prohibitively skeptical.
Post by Baruch
You may be able to demonstrate the existence of your dog to people nearby,
but you really can't demonstrate your dog to me.
I agree with you. Dogs can't be demonstrated over the internet any more
than angels can. You either take them on faith, or you don't. Still, I
think that demonstrating a dog to a skeptic in the same room with you would
be easier than demonstrating an angel to that same skeptic.
Post by Baruch
The thing is that you can test the idea of whether angels exist. You
*cannot* prove it to anyone else. You can't say, "here's my angel", nor
"here's a photo of my angel", nor even "here's a photo of some angel
somewhere". They don't come when they're called (not for others), nor will
they do tricks for you.
In all these respects, dogs seem to be superior to angels. They can be
shown. They can be photographed. They come when they're called and
they'll even do tricks, if they get the idea that you would like them to.

So dogs are much more available and cooperative than angels.
Post by Baruch
But I suspect you'll do as I did. Since I already *knew* that there weren't
angels, or that at least they wouldn't talk to me, I never bothered to
perform the experiment.
I've talked to angels and they've talked to me. But have *you* talked to a
dog yet? Are you going to?
Tom
2003-07-12 05:50:20 UTC
Permalink
Why do you think no one is claiming that dogs talk to us?
No one on this NG said or claimed dogs speak to angels or that dogs speak
to
people about angels. If you feel that your dog talks to you about angels.
Fine. If you feel they psychically communicate with you, fine.
Thank you. I was worried that you'd disapprove.
More importantly. Why don't you feel angels can speak then, for
themselves?

Hey, I didn't say anything like that. I just asked why not just talk to
your dog instead of an angel.
If a dog can speak psychically then why not God or Angels?
I agree. Why not indeed? And vice versa. If angels and God can speak
psychically, so can dogs. So why not talk to your dog? He likes you,
doesn't he? If angels can give you answers to life's problems by psychic
means, so can your dog.
You are attempting to be snide and confuse issues by asking
people to talk to angels through dogs.
You dont need to go through a dog to get to an angel. You don't need to go
any further than the dog. Talk to the dog. He's right there, all day
long. You dont need any special state of consciousness to see him. You
don't have to act all humble and holy to get his respect and interest.
He's just your dog, the same dog that watches you go to the bathroom and
doesn't find the sight as repulsive as any of your dearest human friends
would. No charades, no dishonesty. He's your dog. Why not ask his advice
rather than from some morally high-falutin' angel?
Sonya Fitzpatrick, star of TV's "Pet Psychic" has Seven Secrets to
Tuning
in to Your Pet.
"Tuning into a pet" Is not the same as talking to it.
Watch Ms. Fitzpatrick's show and you'll see that she definitely talks to
the pets she's "tuned into".
However, Ms.
Fitzpatrick is correct. Pets of all descriptions can be communicated
with.
Otherwise they'd be what we call "Wild animals."
Ms. Fizpatrick, and many others insist you can talk to "wild" animals, too.
Laura Simpson, author of "Communicating with Animals", says that some
breeds of dog are more psychic than others.
I would like to see some firm scientific evidence of this.
What firm scientific evidence did you see regarding angels?
My estimation
would be some dogs are closer to people in spirit than others. A
wild dingo or Cape Hunting Dog for instance would not give the
same reaction to psychic stimulus from a human as a Collie.
Yes, I can see that rapport with a wild animal might be more difficult than
with domesticated ones, because the wild ones don't give a rat's behind
whether we live or die. Might there be wild and tame angels, too?
In his book "Kinship with All Life", J. Allen Boone talks about
establishing a two-way "mental bridge" between you and your pet. This
invisible bridge allows thoughts to go from human to pet, and vice
versa.
All of this is workable. However not one thing this Tom guy said proves
that
angels and dogs are communicating and that people should talk to their
dogs
instead of angels.
Angels (such as they are) and dogs (such as they are) do communicate with
us, Dave. It's us people who, all too often, aren't willing to communicate
with them. As to whether they communicate with each other, that's a
question I've never asked my dog. I'll do so tonight and tell you what he
says.
Of course some animals have psychic links with people.
That has been evidenced for 100,000 years or more. So have people's
dealing
with Angelic Entities. So talk to your animals AND to the Angels.
Now there's a good idea. Maybe a committee of angels, household pets, and
even members of one's immediate family could get together and have a
meeting to decide what you should do next. Everybody could share ideas and
viewpoints. A sort of spiritual psycho-social gestalt thing.
angelicusrex
2003-07-12 08:26:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tom
Thank you. I was worried that you'd disapprove.
I'll just bet you did!
Post by Tom
Hey, I didn't say anything like that. I just asked why not just talk to
your dog instead of an angel.
Because angels can speak for themselves. They are here to help humans, not
dogs. Dogs don't know as much as angels.
Post by Tom
I agree. Why not indeed? And vice versa.
What you're saying makes no logical sense. It's like I said: saying "Talk to
your doctor!" Then you say: "Instead of talking to your doctor, talk to your
dog!"

I happen to know angels know more and communicate better with us than dogs.
One of my angels is a doctor. Is your dog a doctor? Or is it an angel? Your
dog is a dog. When you communicate with it, you will get "dog thoughts."
When you communicate with angels, you get angel thoughts.
Post by Tom
If angels and God can speak
psychically, so can dogs.
So can everything else that has a brain. However some brains, like dolphins
and chimps for instance are smarter than your dog. Why not talk to them too?
Angels are smarter than people. Talk to your angels. Not your dog. Unless
you like chatting up dauschaunds. Angels are here to serve. You are here to
troll.
Post by Tom
So why not talk to your dog? He likes you,
doesn't he?
No my dog doesn't like anyone. I don't have a dog. I have two birds. But
they are crazy. I have to keep them in a cage, for their own good.
Post by Tom
If angels can give you answers to life's problems by psychic
means, so can your dog.
No your dog cannot give answers to your life's problems. if you think so,
then you need help. Because you evidently think your dog is smarter than you
are. But I suppose that's why he makes you take him out to go to the
bathroom and leads you around on that leash.
Post by Tom
You dont need to go through a dog to get to an angel.
You don't need to go through a dog to get to anyone else.
Post by Tom
You don't need to go
any further than the dog. Talk to the dog.
Yes, you do need to go further than the dog. Ask Son of Sam. He talked to
his dog. But things got somewhat out of hand.
Post by Tom
He's right there, all day
long.
So what? Does than make him capable of answering my life's questions? Does
he understand banking? Plumbing? Computers? Angels DO.
Post by Tom
You dont need any special state of consciousness to see him.
But you need one to communicate with him. You can use precisely the same
method to contact angels. And angels know more than your silly pooch.
Post by Tom
You
don't have to act all humble and holy to get his respect and interest.
No he just has to act that way to you!
Post by Tom
He's just your dog, the same dog that watches you go to the bathroom and
doesn't find the sight as repulsive as any of your dearest human friends
You let your dog watch you go to the bathroom? Has he learned how to wipe
himself yet? Or perhaps he can teach you to lick yourself like he does? What
a simple answer to a simple question that would be!
Post by Tom
would. No charades, no dishonesty.
Are you saying dogs are honest, but angels are dishonest???
Post by Tom
He's your dog. Why not ask his advice
rather than from some morally high-falutin' angel?
Who said angels were "morally high-falutin'?" Oh, I remember, YOU said it.
You are making a lot of fallacious illogical extrapolations about angels and
dogs.
Which tends to tell me that you are just one more troll.
Post by Tom
Watch Ms. Fitzpatrick's show and you'll see that she definitely talks to
the pets she's "tuned into".
You watch it. I'm busy.
Post by Tom
Ms. Fizpatrick, and many others insist you can talk to "wild" animals, too.
Go up to the next tiger you see and have fun with that.
Post by Tom
I would like to see some firm scientific evidence of this.
What firm scientific evidence did you see regarding angels?
I asked you first to present evidence that dogs are somehow different in
their psychic capabilities by breed. These would be simple enough
experiments to perform. When you are done, get back to me and I'll prove
angels exist. But you won't have to have it proven to you, because your dog
will tell you all about them!

According to your own perceptive admonishions. We already "know" for
example, that angels are "moral and high falutin'. And possibly dealing in
charades and being dishonest." Thanks to your dilligent research.
Post by Tom
Yes, I can see that rapport with a wild animal might be more difficult than
with domesticated ones, because the wild ones don't give a rat's behind
whether we live or die. Might there be wild and tame angels, too?
No there might not.
Post by Tom
Angels (such as they are)
Then you really need no proof of angels existing, right? And if you know
they exist, then you must have talked with them and they with you. And at
that point they must have told you that your dog simply cannot answer all
your questions, or ours. They would have told you all about God and how God
answers all our questions. So either you aren't talking to angels, or you
are spending way too much time talking to your dog in the bathroom while you
take a dump, and watching a lot of afternoon TV.

Now, Tom, this is an angel NG. Not a Dog NG. So you might want to tell your
story over at alt.bordercollies.com or whatever. People here are interested
in discussing angels, not German Shepherds.
Post by Tom
and dogs (such as they are) do communicate with
us, Dave.
I already said dogs can communicate with us. But you seem to feel we aren't
communicating enough with them while on the toilet. You seem to be implying
that all dogs can answer all human questions. Ask your dog what life is like
after you die. Or how to go about healing someone's cancer. If he can tell
you these things, write them down, publish a book, and you will be famous!
However, writing about these things here, will net you no fame at all. In
fact, no one will even really listen to you.
Post by Tom
It's us people who, all too often, aren't willing to communicate
with them.
And sometimes people are just too willing to communicate silliness to
others. It confuses people. And some people think this is really funny, to
make waves on NGs, to confuse people, to make silly extrapolations and odd
remarks. It really is a form of disrupting communication. People who do that
on NGs are often called trolls. Maybe your dog didn't tell you that? Oh
well, I will ry to communicate this to you, one human being to another. Stop
talking about dogs here. No one cares. Stop being a self-serving troll.
People will simply turn you off. And stop talking to your dog, who knows
nothing, and start talking to angels, who do know some things.
Post by Tom
As to whether they communicate with each other, that's a
question I've never asked my dog. I'll do so tonight and tell you what he
says.
You do that. Then the research on various breeds would be great. Check back
in whenever.
Post by Tom
Now there's a good idea. Maybe a committee of angels, household pets, and
even members of one's immediate family could get together and have a
meeting to decide what you should do next. Everybody could share ideas and
viewpoints. A sort of spiritual psycho-social gestalt thing.
Why do you pursue this losing proposition, Mr. troll? Are you getting a kick
out of this? Well, all I can say is, bye bye, Mr. troll.

Bye bye now. Bye bye.

Who let the dogs out?

St. Woof-Woof
Saint David and the Angels
2003-07-12 17:00:53 UTC
Permalink
Dear David St. Albans,

I laughed out loud several times at your post,
this morning.

How funny.

Love, and Light,

Saint David
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
Thank you. I was worried that you'd disapprove.
I'll just bet you did!
Post by Tom
Hey, I didn't say anything like that. I just asked why not just talk to
your dog instead of an angel.
Because angels can speak for themselves. They are here to help humans, not
dogs. Dogs don't know as much as angels.
Post by Tom
I agree. Why not indeed? And vice versa.
What you're saying makes no logical sense. It's like I said: saying "Talk to
your doctor!" Then you say: "Instead of talking to your doctor, talk to your
dog!"
I happen to know angels know more and communicate better with us than dogs.
One of my angels is a doctor. Is your dog a doctor? Or is it an angel? Your
dog is a dog. When you communicate with it, you will get "dog thoughts."
When you communicate with angels, you get angel thoughts.
Post by Tom
If angels and God can speak
psychically, so can dogs.
So can everything else that has a brain. However some brains, like dolphins
and chimps for instance are smarter than your dog. Why not talk to them too?
Angels are smarter than people. Talk to your angels. Not your dog. Unless
you like chatting up dauschaunds. Angels are here to serve. You are here to
troll.
Post by Tom
So why not talk to your dog? He likes you,
doesn't he?
No my dog doesn't like anyone. I don't have a dog. I have two birds. But
they are crazy. I have to keep them in a cage, for their own good.
Post by Tom
If angels can give you answers to life's problems by psychic
means, so can your dog.
No your dog cannot give answers to your life's problems. if you think so,
then you need help. Because you evidently think your dog is smarter than you
are. But I suppose that's why he makes you take him out to go to the
bathroom and leads you around on that leash.
Post by Tom
You dont need to go through a dog to get to an angel.
You don't need to go through a dog to get to anyone else.
Post by Tom
You don't need to go
any further than the dog. Talk to the dog.
Yes, you do need to go further than the dog. Ask Son of Sam. He talked to
his dog. But things got somewhat out of hand.
Post by Tom
He's right there, all day
long.
So what? Does than make him capable of answering my life's questions? Does
he understand banking? Plumbing? Computers? Angels DO.
Post by Tom
You dont need any special state of consciousness to see him.
But you need one to communicate with him. You can use precisely the same
method to contact angels. And angels know more than your silly pooch.
Post by Tom
You
don't have to act all humble and holy to get his respect and interest.
No he just has to act that way to you!
Post by Tom
He's just your dog, the same dog that watches you go to the bathroom and
doesn't find the sight as repulsive as any of your dearest human friends
You let your dog watch you go to the bathroom? Has he learned how to wipe
himself yet? Or perhaps he can teach you to lick yourself like he does? What
a simple answer to a simple question that would be!
Post by Tom
would. No charades, no dishonesty.
Are you saying dogs are honest, but angels are dishonest???
Post by Tom
He's your dog. Why not ask his advice
rather than from some morally high-falutin' angel?
Who said angels were "morally high-falutin'?" Oh, I remember, YOU said it.
You are making a lot of fallacious illogical extrapolations about angels and
dogs.
Which tends to tell me that you are just one more troll.
Post by Tom
Watch Ms. Fitzpatrick's show and you'll see that she definitely talks to
the pets she's "tuned into".
You watch it. I'm busy.
Post by Tom
Ms. Fizpatrick, and many others insist you can talk to "wild" animals,
too.
Go up to the next tiger you see and have fun with that.
Post by Tom
I would like to see some firm scientific evidence of this.
What firm scientific evidence did you see regarding angels?
I asked you first to present evidence that dogs are somehow different in
their psychic capabilities by breed. These would be simple enough
experiments to perform. When you are done, get back to me and I'll prove
angels exist. But you won't have to have it proven to you, because your dog
will tell you all about them!
According to your own perceptive admonishions. We already "know" for
example, that angels are "moral and high falutin'. And possibly dealing in
charades and being dishonest." Thanks to your dilligent research.
Post by Tom
Yes, I can see that rapport with a wild animal might be more difficult
than
Post by Tom
with domesticated ones, because the wild ones don't give a rat's behind
whether we live or die. Might there be wild and tame angels, too?
No there might not.
Post by Tom
Angels (such as they are)
Then you really need no proof of angels existing, right? And if you know
they exist, then you must have talked with them and they with you. And at
that point they must have told you that your dog simply cannot answer all
your questions, or ours. They would have told you all about God and how God
answers all our questions. So either you aren't talking to angels, or you
are spending way too much time talking to your dog in the bathroom while you
take a dump, and watching a lot of afternoon TV.
Now, Tom, this is an angel NG. Not a Dog NG. So you might want to tell your
story over at alt.bordercollies.com or whatever. People here are interested
in discussing angels, not German Shepherds.
Post by Tom
and dogs (such as they are) do communicate with
us, Dave.
I already said dogs can communicate with us. But you seem to feel we aren't
communicating enough with them while on the toilet. You seem to be implying
that all dogs can answer all human questions. Ask your dog what life is like
after you die. Or how to go about healing someone's cancer. If he can tell
you these things, write them down, publish a book, and you will be famous!
However, writing about these things here, will net you no fame at all. In
fact, no one will even really listen to you.
Post by Tom
It's us people who, all too often, aren't willing to communicate
with them.
And sometimes people are just too willing to communicate silliness to
others. It confuses people. And some people think this is really funny, to
make waves on NGs, to confuse people, to make silly extrapolations and odd
remarks. It really is a form of disrupting communication. People who do that
on NGs are often called trolls. Maybe your dog didn't tell you that? Oh
well, I will ry to communicate this to you, one human being to another. Stop
talking about dogs here. No one cares. Stop being a self-serving troll.
People will simply turn you off. And stop talking to your dog, who knows
nothing, and start talking to angels, who do know some things.
Post by Tom
As to whether they communicate with each other, that's a
question I've never asked my dog. I'll do so tonight and tell you what he
says.
You do that. Then the research on various breeds would be great. Check back
in whenever.
Post by Tom
Now there's a good idea. Maybe a committee of angels, household pets, and
even members of one's immediate family could get together and have a
meeting to decide what you should do next. Everybody could share ideas
and
Post by Tom
viewpoints. A sort of spiritual psycho-social gestalt thing.
Why do you pursue this losing proposition, Mr. troll? Are you getting a kick
out of this? Well, all I can say is, bye bye, Mr. troll.
Bye bye now. Bye bye.
Who let the dogs out?
St. Woof-Woof
Saint David and the Angels
2003-07-12 17:34:29 UTC
Permalink
Dear David St. Albans,

My Airedale telepathically spoke to me,
today. He told me that he likes to make
turd pyramids in the backyard, with an
infinite number of sides.

He also told me that he is a descendant
in a long line of Egyptian new age mystics,
and descended from Imhotep himself.

Chopper says he is working on making
a pyramid like Cheops.

Since my dog spoke to me, this must be true.

He also has watched me take a dump,
so we have bonded.

Love, and Light,

Saint David
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
Thank you. I was worried that you'd disapprove.
I'll just bet you did!
Post by Tom
Hey, I didn't say anything like that. I just asked why not just talk to
your dog instead of an angel.
Because angels can speak for themselves. They are here to help humans, not
dogs. Dogs don't know as much as angels.
Post by Tom
I agree. Why not indeed? And vice versa.
What you're saying makes no logical sense. It's like I said: saying "Talk to
your doctor!" Then you say: "Instead of talking to your doctor, talk to your
dog!"
I happen to know angels know more and communicate better with us than dogs.
One of my angels is a doctor. Is your dog a doctor? Or is it an angel? Your
dog is a dog. When you communicate with it, you will get "dog thoughts."
When you communicate with angels, you get angel thoughts.
Post by Tom
If angels and God can speak
psychically, so can dogs.
So can everything else that has a brain. However some brains, like dolphins
and chimps for instance are smarter than your dog. Why not talk to them too?
Angels are smarter than people. Talk to your angels. Not your dog. Unless
you like chatting up dauschaunds. Angels are here to serve. You are here to
troll.
Post by Tom
So why not talk to your dog? He likes you,
doesn't he?
No my dog doesn't like anyone. I don't have a dog. I have two birds. But
they are crazy. I have to keep them in a cage, for their own good.
Post by Tom
If angels can give you answers to life's problems by psychic
means, so can your dog.
No your dog cannot give answers to your life's problems. if you think so,
then you need help. Because you evidently think your dog is smarter than you
are. But I suppose that's why he makes you take him out to go to the
bathroom and leads you around on that leash.
Post by Tom
You dont need to go through a dog to get to an angel.
You don't need to go through a dog to get to anyone else.
Post by Tom
You don't need to go
any further than the dog. Talk to the dog.
Yes, you do need to go further than the dog. Ask Son of Sam. He talked to
his dog. But things got somewhat out of hand.
Post by Tom
He's right there, all day
long.
So what? Does than make him capable of answering my life's questions? Does
he understand banking? Plumbing? Computers? Angels DO.
Post by Tom
You dont need any special state of consciousness to see him.
But you need one to communicate with him. You can use precisely the same
method to contact angels. And angels know more than your silly pooch.
Post by Tom
You
don't have to act all humble and holy to get his respect and interest.
No he just has to act that way to you!
Post by Tom
He's just your dog, the same dog that watches you go to the bathroom and
doesn't find the sight as repulsive as any of your dearest human friends
You let your dog watch you go to the bathroom? Has he learned how to wipe
himself yet? Or perhaps he can teach you to lick yourself like he does? What
a simple answer to a simple question that would be!
Post by Tom
would. No charades, no dishonesty.
Are you saying dogs are honest, but angels are dishonest???
Post by Tom
He's your dog. Why not ask his advice
rather than from some morally high-falutin' angel?
Who said angels were "morally high-falutin'?" Oh, I remember, YOU said it.
You are making a lot of fallacious illogical extrapolations about angels and
dogs.
Which tends to tell me that you are just one more troll.
Post by Tom
Watch Ms. Fitzpatrick's show and you'll see that she definitely talks to
the pets she's "tuned into".
You watch it. I'm busy.
Post by Tom
Ms. Fizpatrick, and many others insist you can talk to "wild" animals,
too.
Go up to the next tiger you see and have fun with that.
Post by Tom
I would like to see some firm scientific evidence of this.
What firm scientific evidence did you see regarding angels?
I asked you first to present evidence that dogs are somehow different in
their psychic capabilities by breed. These would be simple enough
experiments to perform. When you are done, get back to me and I'll prove
angels exist. But you won't have to have it proven to you, because your dog
will tell you all about them!
According to your own perceptive admonishions. We already "know" for
example, that angels are "moral and high falutin'. And possibly dealing in
charades and being dishonest." Thanks to your dilligent research.
Post by Tom
Yes, I can see that rapport with a wild animal might be more difficult
than
Post by Tom
with domesticated ones, because the wild ones don't give a rat's behind
whether we live or die. Might there be wild and tame angels, too?
No there might not.
Post by Tom
Angels (such as they are)
Then you really need no proof of angels existing, right? And if you know
they exist, then you must have talked with them and they with you. And at
that point they must have told you that your dog simply cannot answer all
your questions, or ours. They would have told you all about God and how God
answers all our questions. So either you aren't talking to angels, or you
are spending way too much time talking to your dog in the bathroom while you
take a dump, and watching a lot of afternoon TV.
Now, Tom, this is an angel NG. Not a Dog NG. So you might want to tell your
story over at alt.bordercollies.com or whatever. People here are interested
in discussing angels, not German Shepherds.
Post by Tom
and dogs (such as they are) do communicate with
us, Dave.
I already said dogs can communicate with us. But you seem to feel we aren't
communicating enough with them while on the toilet. You seem to be implying
that all dogs can answer all human questions. Ask your dog what life is like
after you die. Or how to go about healing someone's cancer. If he can tell
you these things, write them down, publish a book, and you will be famous!
However, writing about these things here, will net you no fame at all. In
fact, no one will even really listen to you.
Post by Tom
It's us people who, all too often, aren't willing to communicate
with them.
And sometimes people are just too willing to communicate silliness to
others. It confuses people. And some people think this is really funny, to
make waves on NGs, to confuse people, to make silly extrapolations and odd
remarks. It really is a form of disrupting communication. People who do that
on NGs are often called trolls. Maybe your dog didn't tell you that? Oh
well, I will ry to communicate this to you, one human being to another. Stop
talking about dogs here. No one cares. Stop being a self-serving troll.
People will simply turn you off. And stop talking to your dog, who knows
nothing, and start talking to angels, who do know some things.
Post by Tom
As to whether they communicate with each other, that's a
question I've never asked my dog. I'll do so tonight and tell you what he
says.
You do that. Then the research on various breeds would be great. Check back
in whenever.
Post by Tom
Now there's a good idea. Maybe a committee of angels, household pets, and
even members of one's immediate family could get together and have a
meeting to decide what you should do next. Everybody could share ideas
and
Post by Tom
viewpoints. A sort of spiritual psycho-social gestalt thing.
Why do you pursue this losing proposition, Mr. troll? Are you getting a kick
out of this? Well, all I can say is, bye bye, Mr. troll.
Bye bye now. Bye bye.
Who let the dogs out?
St. Woof-Woof
Tom
2003-07-12 23:29:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by Saint David and the Angels
Dear David St. Albans,
My Airedale telepathically spoke to me,
today. He told me that he likes to make
turd pyramids in the backyard, with an
infinite number of sides.
He also told me that he is a descendant
in a long line of Egyptian new age mystics,
and descended from Imhotep himself.
Chopper says he is working on making
a pyramid like Cheops.
Since my dog spoke to me, this must be true.
He also has watched me take a dump,
so we have bonded.
Love, and Light,
Saint David
Hey, if you can't trust your own dog, who can you trust?

Ms. Fitzpatrick didn't mention airedales in her comments about the relative
psychic ability of different breeds.

Oops, David St. Albans specifically ordered me not to mention dogs in his
newsgroup again and here I went and did it. That was inconsiderate of me.
I'll try not to do it again.

From here on I'll refer to them as d-gs.
Tom
2003-07-12 23:06:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
Hey, I didn't say anything like that. I just asked why
not just talk to your dog instead of an angel.
Because angels can speak for themselves. They are here
to help humans, not dogs.
My dog hasn't asked any angels for help. He can usually handle stuff on
his own. He does ask me for help once in a while, just like I ask him for
help once in a while. We're friends, you see.
Post by angelicusrex
Dogs don't know as much as angels.
Have you carefully checked just how much a dog knows? I realize you're
much more familiar with angels, but you shouldn't be so quick to decide
about beings you don't know all that well.
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
I agree. Why not indeed? And vice versa.
saying "Talk to your doctor!" Then you say: "Instead of talking
to your doctor, talk to your dog!"
What if your dog is a doctor?
Post by angelicusrex
I happen to know angels know more and communicate better
with us than dogs.
Perhaps if you spent as much time and energy communicating with dogs as you
do with angels, you might find that they're just as knowledgeable
psychically as any angel.
Post by angelicusrex
One of my angels is a doctor. Is your dog a doctor?
He might be. I never asked him about his professional background. Are you
declaring that no dogs are doctors? Can you prove that my dog is *not* a
doctor? I don't think you can, any more than I could prove your angel is
not a doctor.

Let's put the shoe on the other foot for a moment, though. Do you think
that a person should go see an angel instead of a doctor?
Post by angelicusrex
Or is it an angel? Your
dog is a dog. When you communicate with it, you will get "dog thoughts."
When you communicate with angels, you get angel thoughts.
You are assuming, of course, that angel thoughts are somehow superior to
dog thoughts. I don't think you have established that yet. It might be as
difficult to do as trying to demonstrate the existence of angels or dogs to
someone over the internet. If you can't even show that angels exist,
wouldn't you find it even harder to show that any quality they may possess
is superior to that quality in any other given being?
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
If angels and God can speak
psychically, so can dogs.
So can everything else that has a brain. However some brains, like
dolphins and chimps for instance are smarter than your dog. Why
not talk to them too?
Chimps and dolphins don't live in my neighborhood. If they did, I'd feel
free to talk to them, too. What makes you think that they're smarter than
dogs, though?
Post by angelicusrex
Angels are smarter than people.
How do you know this?
Post by angelicusrex
Talk to your angels. Not your dog. Unless
you like chatting up dauschaunds. Angels are here
to serve. You are here to troll.
My goodness. There's that negative energy again. I don't see why you have
to resort to insults and ridicule.

My dog is a faithful and loyal companion. He's not my servant. He's my
friend, and he helps me all he can, as good friends do.

Do you think of your angels as servants?
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
So why not talk to your dog? He likes you,
doesn't he?
No my dog doesn't like anyone. I don't have a dog.
So you don't really know that much about dogs, eh?
Post by angelicusrex
I have two birds. But
they are crazy. I have to keep them in a cage, for their own good.
I think you lack the inclination to talk to your birds, too. You're just
not
properly understanding one another. Here's a story about a psychic parrot:

http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_126513.html?nav_src=newsIndexHeadline
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
If angels can give you answers to life's problems by psychic
means, so can your dog.
No your dog cannot give answers to your life's problems.
Mine can. Others have reported the same thing.
Post by angelicusrex
if you think so, then you need help.
Has anyone ever told you that if you think that angels are giving you
answers to life's problems, then you need help? I'll bet some people have.
People are often cruel and hostile to people with beliefs they don't share.
Post by angelicusrex
Because you evidently think your dog is smarter than you
are.
I've never tried to compare my intelligence with that of a dog. It seems
presumptuous and needlessly competitive. Knowledge and wisdom aren't just
smarts, Dave. A wise man might be less intelligent than you but still know
what you don't.
Post by angelicusrex
But I suppose that's why he makes you take him out to go to the
bathroom and leads you around on that leash.
Such sneering! Such an attempt to belittle me! Dave, are your angels
encouraging you to bully me? Is that the kind of advice they give you?

My dog tells me that you're engaged in a dominance game. That you want to
be "top dog".
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
You dont need to go through a dog to get to an angel.
You don't need to go through a dog to get to anyone else.
That's right, Dave, you don't. Just as you don't need to go through an
angel to get to anyone else.
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
You don't need to go
any further than the dog. Talk to the dog.
Yes, you do need to go further than the dog. Ask Son of Sam. He talked to
his dog. But things got somewhat out of hand.
No, he didn't.

In the first place, it wasn't his dog. It was the neighbor's dog.

In the second place, David Berkowitz says he was talking to a 6000 year old
demon who communicated *through* the dog. He never talked to the dog.

Like I say, I don't recommend talking to anyone through a dog.

I wonder if there has ever been a psychotic murderer who thought that he
was talking to angels. I bet there has. Should I check it out for you?
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
He's right there, all day long.
So what? Does than make him capable of answering my life's questions?
I don't know about your life's questions. They may be very different from
mine.

In my case, though, no, his presence doesn't make him cabable of answering
my questions. It makes him aware and involved, which motivates him to
answer. He was capable of answering life's questions already. I didn't
"make" him so.
Post by angelicusrex
Does he understand banking? Plumbing? Computers? Angels DO.
Yes, he does. Just because he doesn't require any of those things doesn't
mean he doesn't understand them. Do angels need plumbing? Do they have
any plumbing of their own? If not, then does that mean they can't
understand plumbing?
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
You dont need any special state of consciousness to see him.
But you need one to communicate with him.
Did you read Ms. Fitzpatrick's tips? I posted them. They show that no
special state other than readiness to listen uncritically is required.
When I'm seriously trying to listen to any good friend, regardless of
species, I do the same thing. Don't you?
Post by angelicusrex
And angels know more than your silly pooch.
Have you met my dog? Upon what evidence do you base your claim that he's a
"silly pooch"? It sounds to me like plain prejudice, Dave. It seems
unworthy of a sincerely spiritual person such as yourself.
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
You
don't have to act all humble and holy to get his respect and interest.
No he just has to act that way to you!
He acts the way he chooses, Dave. He's my friend, not my thrall.
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
He's just your dog, the same dog that watches you go to
the bathroom and doesn't find the sight as repulsive as
any of your dearest human friends
You let your dog watch you go to the bathroom? Has he learned
how to wipe himself yet? Or perhaps he can teach you to lick
yourself like he does? What
a simple answer to a simple question that would be!
Dave, I'm quite concerned about the increasing intensity of your negative
energy. I don't understand why you react so negatively to my relationship
with my dog. You have directed insult and ridicule at me and a totally
innocent and inoffensive dog without, as far as I can tell, any provocation
from me. What's bothering you so much about what I say?
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
No charades, no dishonesty.
Are you saying dogs are honest, but angels are dishonest???
No, I'm saying that a dog doesn't inspire *us* to play charades or present
ourselves as better than we really are in order to impress or persuade him.
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
He's your dog. Why not ask his advice
rather than from some morally high-falutin' angel?
Who said angels were "morally high-falutin'?" Oh, I
remember, YOU said it.
Yes. I was under the impression that you believed that angels are morally
superior to human beings. Am I incorrect?
Post by angelicusrex
You are making a lot of fallacious illogical extrapolations about
angels and dogs.
Which tends to tell me that you are just one more troll.
Feel free to correct any of my misunderstandings. Let's be sure they're
actually things I have stated and in the context that I am stating them,
though. That'll prevent a lot of confusion.
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
Watch Ms. Fitzpatrick's show and you'll see that she
definitely talks to the pets she's "tuned into".
You watch it. I'm busy.
Ah, that negative energy. Dave, I'm very concerned that you might not be
very happy or secure, given the lengths you are going to be offensive to
someone who hasn't offered you a single disparaging word.
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
Ms. Fizpatrick, and many others insist you can talk to "wild" animals,
too.
Go up to the next tiger you see and have fun with that.
There aren't any in my neighborhood. I had a discussion with a family of
opposums last fall, but that was just neighborly chat. I wouldn't say we
touched on any profound issues.
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
I would like to see some firm scientific evidence of this.
What firm scientific evidence did you see regarding angels?
I asked you first to present evidence that dogs are somehow different in
their psychic capabilities by breed.
Were you asking me to present evidence? I thought you were just saying
you'd like to see some. So I thought maybe you had some for your angels.

Actually, I have done no research on varying psychic abilities between dog
breeds. I doubt that Ms. Fitzpatrick has either. I think she was speaking
from personal experience with a large number of different breeds of dog.
Post by angelicusrex
These would be simple enough experiments to perform.
How would you go about it?
Post by angelicusrex
When you are done, get back to me
and I'll prove angels exist.
Didn't you say earlier that it would be impossible to prove the existence
of angels to someone over the internet? Are you now saying that you could
if you wanted to?
Post by angelicusrex
But you won't have to have it proven to you, because your
dog will tell you all about them!
I wonder what good you think all this negativity is doing.
Post by angelicusrex
According to your own perceptive admonishions. We already
"know" for example, that angels are "moral and high falutin'.
And possibly dealing in charades and being dishonest."
Dave, do you really think that's what I meant? If so, you've got the
wrong idea about my attitude towards angels.

I am not saying that angels are in any way dishonest. I have no basis for
such a claim. My impression that angels have high-falutin' morals comes
from your own assertions about their superiority and the general reputation
of angels as spiritual beings with close and constant access to the Divine.
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
Might there be wild and tame angels, too?
No there might not.
What are "fallen angels", then? Might they not be considered feral angels?
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
Angels (such as they are)
Then you really need no proof of angels existing, right?
I don't recall asking for any such proof. I did ask you if you had any
scientific evidence for angels, but that was because you said you'd like to
see evidence about psychic powers of different dog breeds and I thought
maybe you were into scientific evidence.
Post by angelicusrex
And if you know
they exist, then you must have talked with them and they with you.
I recall saying so specifically.
Post by angelicusrex
And at that point they must have told you that your dog simply
cannot answer all your questions, or ours.
No, I can't say that they ever said anything like that. Of course, it may
simply have been because the subject of their superiority to dogs never
came up. Do you think I should find an angel and ask?
Post by angelicusrex
They would have told you all about God and how God
answers all our questions.
So why are you still talking to angels, then? Shouldn't you be talking to
God?
Post by angelicusrex
So either you aren't talking to angels, or you
are spending way too much time talking to your dog in
the bathroom while you
take a dump, and watching a lot of afternoon TV.
Are you generally this negative, or is this unusual behavior for you?
Post by angelicusrex
Now, Tom, this is an angel NG. Not a Dog NG. So you might
want to tell your
story over at alt.bordercollies.com or whatever.
Well, I can understand that alt.religion.angels might be called an "angel
NG", but I note that this thread is cross-posted to five newsgroups, only
one of which is specifically about angels.
Post by angelicusrex
People here are interested
in discussing angels, not German Shepherds.
I think most people who read these newsgroups are interested in
spirituality and where information that may be of spiritual value can be
found. But I could be mistaken, of course.
Post by angelicusrex
I already said dogs can communicate with us. But you seem to
feel we aren't communicating enough with them while on the
toilet.
Oh,Dave, you know I never said anything like that. This is just more of
your negative bullying tactics.
Post by angelicusrex
You seem to be implying
that all dogs can answer all human questions.
I don't know about all dogs. I haven't met all dogs. Have you?
Post by angelicusrex
Ask your dog what life is like
after you die.
How would we check his answer?
Post by angelicusrex
Or how to go about healing someone's cancer. If he can
tell you these things, write them down, publish a book,
and you will be famous!
Have you done this with your angels?
Post by angelicusrex
However, writing about these things here, will net you no fame at all. In
fact, no one will even really listen to you.
What gave you the impression that I was seeking fame?
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
It's us people who, all too often, aren't willing to communicate
with them.
And sometimes people are just too willing to communicate silliness to
others.
Has anyone ever called your beliefs silly, Dave? I'll bet some have.
People usually think of any beliefs significantly different from their own
as silly.
Post by angelicusrex
It confuses people.
People become confused by hearing what someone else believes?
Post by angelicusrex
And some people think this is really funny,
to make waves on NGs, to confuse people, to make silly
extrapolations and odd remarks.
Have I been making waves? Who have I confused? What extrapolations have I
made? How are they silly?

As for "odd", well, Dave, I suspect that outside of your single newsgroup,
your own comments about angels might sound more than a little "odd"
themselves.
Post by angelicusrex
It really is a form of disrupting
communication. People who do
that on NGs are often called trolls.
I've tried quite diligently to keep my remarks respectful and on-topic.
You, on the other hand, have been distorting my statements, accusing me of
saying things that I never said, calling me names, and offering ridicule
and insult in lieu of intelligent conversation. That is what I'd call
"disrupting communication". It appears to me that you don't want to
communicate and share ideas. You seem intent on lecturing and bullying
people with divergent views.

I said that my dog told me that you were playing dominance games and it
appears he was right again.
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
As to whether they communicate with each other, that's a
question I've never asked my dog. I'll do so tonight and tell
you what he says.
You do that. Then the research on various breeds would be
great. Check back in whenever.
OK, I asked and my dog told me that dogs can indeed talk to angels, but he
doesn't see any reason why they would seek each other out particularly.
Post by angelicusrex
Post by Tom
Now there's a good idea. Maybe a committee of angels,
household pets, and even members of one's immediate
family could get together and have a meeting to decide
what you should do next. Everybody could share ideas
and viewpoints. A sort of spiritual psycho-social gestalt thing.
Why do you pursue this losing proposition, Mr. troll? Are you
getting a kick out of this? Well, all I can say is, bye bye, Mr. troll.
Bye bye now. Bye bye.
Who let the dogs out?
St. Woof-Woof
I think you are trying to disrupt this communication.
John B
2003-07-12 10:56:29 UTC
Permalink
<snip>
Post by Tom
If a dog can speak psychically then why not God or Angels?
I agree. Why not indeed? And vice versa. If angels and God can speak
psychically, so can dogs. So why not talk to your dog? He likes you,
doesn't he? If angels can give you answers to life's problems by psychic
means, so can your dog.
...nice
Post by Tom
You are attempting to be snide and confuse issues by asking
people to talk to angels through dogs.
You dont need to go through a dog to get to an angel. You don't need to go
any further than the dog. Talk to the dog. He's right there, all day
long. You dont need any special state of consciousness to see him. You
don't have to act all humble and holy to get his respect and interest.
He's just your dog, the same dog that watches you go to the bathroom and
doesn't find the sight as repulsive as any of your dearest human friends
would. No charades, no dishonesty. He's your dog. Why not ask his advice
rather than from some morally high-falutin' angel?
The only case I can remember of angels talking through dogs was Son of
Sam...I think. Do fallen angels count? In the old days a guardian
angel was always paired with a personal demon... Are we asking them
for their opinions on things, too? or just the good angels?

<snip>

JB
m***@you.com
2003-07-12 20:11:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tom
Post by angelicusrex
Instead of you telling me how you "think" the world works. Why don't you
allow your ANGELS to tell you exactly how it works?
Or why don't you just ask your dog?
or your cat. or your goldfish?
The Natural Philosopher
2003-07-13 09:29:13 UTC
Permalink
Probably because no one is claiming that dogs speak to us, while some *are*
claiming that angels do. So it would be appropriate to speak to angels to
see whether they answer. You never know, until you try...
First, find your angel...
angelicusrex
2003-07-13 18:30:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by The Natural Philosopher
First, find your angel...
How are these pithy little one sentence cosmic revelations and "answers"
really helping people? Here's my answer. Do you want to find your angel?
Read about how to do it in my book: Speaking of Angels. It's out now from
iUniverse.com. Or you can go back in the archive from 1997 to the present
and try reading the thousands of pages I wrote here on the subject.

However if you are just going to blithely say "First find your angel." I
will blithely say, good luck, with instructions or directions like that,
you'll be lucky to find your own butt with a flashlight.

Saint Albans
Tom
2003-07-13 21:56:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by angelicusrex
Post by The Natural Philosopher
First, find your angel...
How are these pithy little one sentence cosmic revelations and "answers"
really helping people? Here's my answer. Do you want to find your angel?
Read about how to do it in my book: Speaking of Angels. It's out now from
iUniverse.com. Or you can go back in the archive from 1997 to the present
and try reading the thousands of pages I wrote here on the subject.
Ask your dog what life is like
after you die. Or how to go about healing someone's cancer. If he can
tell
Post by angelicusrex
you these things, write them down, publish a book, and you will be
famous!
Post by angelicusrex
However, writing about these things here, will net you no fame at all. In
fact, no one will even really listen to you.
I believe you, Dave. You have certainly provided enough evidence to
support your claim that writing about these things here will net a person
no fame at all. As you say, no one will even really listen to you.

You are clearly the voice of experience in these matters. Thousands of
pages, you say. Thousands...

Your persistence is admirable.

angelicusrex
2003-07-10 18:17:00 UTC
Permalink
Don't surf to this guy Claudio's site. It has an aggressive malicious code
that tries to make you subscribe and download something called
auroralightlink.com and alt.clearing.05.

The site is a huge fifty page One Pararagraph rant about strange and
pseudo-prophetic things. Hardly worth trying to get through the first few
lines.

This guy thinks he IS the Matrix!

Saint Albans
angelicusrex
2003-07-11 17:20:05 UTC
Permalink
An interesting thought: Guardian angels are metaphysically bound to their
charge. If their charge "dies" unnaturally, the Guardian ceases to exist.
How does this follow? If I die, does my butler cease to exist? My wife? My
family? No they do not. Existence IS. Once a thing or being exists, like
energy it cannot cease to exist. Guardians do not cease to exist in your
scenario because frankly, there's no such thing as dying "unnaturally."
Death happens precisely in a natural way. And most deaths are already
plotted out. Guardians aid with people's lives. Other angels help bring us
over to their plane of existence when we die, but the Guardian helps in any
case. Then they are given some other charge to guard. They aren't brought
into existence when their charge is. Because guess what? You (the charge)
have existed forever. And so has your guradian. You might be his or her
guardian from a previous life.
Otherwise what motivation would they have to protect us?? Just another
crazy
post from... ME
They don't protect us from death. They protect us from the ill effects of
life and from accidents, mistakes in judgment and other people's free-will
machinations.

Saint
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